Isolationism vs. Non-interventionism vs Interventionism

[Godspeed1976]

Information sited from Wiki, The Libertarian Reader. pp. 336–344, Barry, A Global Affairs Commentary: The Terms of Power, National Security Council, and Merriam-Webster.

Isolationism: : A policy of national isolation by abstention from alliances and other international political and economic relations. A foreign policy which combines a non-interventionist military policy and a political policy of economic nationalism (protectionism). In other words, it asserts both of the following:


Non-interventionism – Political rulers should avoid entangling alliances with other nations and avoid all wars not related to direct territorial self-defense.

Protectionism – There should be legal barriers to control trade and cultural exchange with people in other states.


Countries who practice Isolationism:

China
Ireland
Japan
Paraguay



Non-interventionism The state or policy of not intervening (nonintervention in the affairs of other countries). A foreign policy which holds that political rulers should avoid alliances with other nations and avoid all wars not related to direct territorial self-defense. A similar phrase is "strategic independence". Examples of supporters of non-interventionism are Presidents George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, who both favored nonintervention in European Wars while maintaining free trade.

Countries who practice Non-Interventionism:

New Zealand
Sweden
Switzerland
The United States (roughly between 1776-1914)


Interventionism (or Premption)is a foreign policy in which war is waged in an attempt to repel or defeat a perceived inevitable offensive or invasion, or to gain a strategic advantage in an impending (allegedly unavoidable) war before that threat materializes. Preemptive wars are more often argued to be justified or justifiable (although international law categorically rejects Preemptive war). United States president George W. Bush. The phrase initially described the policy that the United States had the right to aggressively secure itself from countries that harbor or give aid to terrorist groups, which was used to justify the 2001 invasion of Afghanistan.

Later it came to include additional elements, including the controversial policy of preventive war, which held that the United States should depose foreign regimes that represented a potential or perceived threat to the security of the United States, even if that threat was not immediate; a policy of spreading democracy around the world, especially in the Middle East, as a strategy for combating terrorism; and a willingness to pursue U.S. military interests in a unilateral way. Some of these policies were codified in a National Security Council text entitled the National Security Strategy of the United States published on September 20, 2002.

Countries who practice Interventionism:

The United States of America
Israel
The Former Soviet Republic



I wanted to site these terms since so many people I talk to seem to think myself and Dr. Paul are Isolationist. We are not, nor were are founding fathers. I would love to hear input from you all on these is you are interested in debating the pros and cons of each.

[Swine]

I miss talking about cars.:(

[Godspeed1976]

Sorry for some reason I thought the Foreign Policy of the country we live in (since 1917) that has killed tens and hundreds of thousands of our fellow citizens trumped cars.

My bad...

[Swine]

Sorry for some reason I thought the Foreign Policy of the country we live in (since 1917) that has killed tens and hundreds of thousands of our fellow citizens trumped cars.

My bad...


Time and place for everything, go talk on a political forum. I, as well as many others, dont want to hear it or see it here.


Btw, your soap box is not as big as you think it is.:rolleyes:

[Godspeed1976]

Time and place for everything, go talk on a political forum. I, as well as many others, dont want to hear it or see it here.


Btw, your soap box is not as big as you think it is.:rolleyes:

Ummm...time and place...
Place is right.
General Discussion (38 Viewing)
New member introductions and miscellaneous topics post here.

Time is right IMO unless you think we should go on electing people who will put us into war. Either Obama's war with Pakistan or McCain's war with Iran.

I take it you are telling me that political debate is not welcomed or wanted at aSpeed even if it is posted in the correct location? Or are you just saying that my political debate topics are not wanted here? Some people find educating themselves important.

This soap box is only 48 views big. If no one wants to talk about it, then live and learn. If you and "others" personally don't like my post then don't post in it, or read it. Or maybe you think I should run my post topics by you for approval before I post them.

[linuxman51]

its a huge waste of time to argue politics on the internet. Just look how much of the billions of people who supported RP showed up at the polls for proof of that :rolleyes:

Its a car forum. Go over to moveon.org or some cesspool like that. The subject manor is not what is offensive or irritating, its the vehicle employed.

[Godspeed1976]

its a huge waste of time to argue politics on the internet. Just look how much of the billions of people who supported RP showed up at the polls for proof of that :rolleyes:
Are we not able to just talk about an idea? How many times has aSpeed argue domestics vs. imports, or even more recently Mustangs vs. anything else? That is faaaaaar more pointless then discussing world events as the relate to the world. Discussion Forums are for discussion. When did it become inappropriate to discuss what is going on in the country we live in in a forum marked for Misc Posts?

Its a car forum. Go over to moveon.org or some cesspool like that. The subject manor is not what is offensive or irritating, its the vehicle employed.

I understand it is a car forum, however if posts like these are ok on this car forum, then I do not see why my post is unacceptable or unwanted other then the fact that you may not agree with it. Am I missing somethign deeper?
we'll see. the really dangerous thing about this election is both houses are likely to be overwhelmingly democrat, and with a democrat president things could get out of hand fairly quickly.

just a recap in laymens terms, if you:

-make more than about 25k per anum, your taxes will likely skyrocket
-healthcare could tank
-further destabilization of the middle east after they immediately recall the troops (but taxes will still go up)
-lessening of illegals enforcement, possibly even giving those here asylum (WTF)

Issues that will be talked about but nothing done about:
-gay marriage (fucking legalize this and be done with the goddamn thing)
-stem cell research
-abortion rights
-oil prices and alternative energy sources
-social security being 'broken'

I'm sure I'm leaving a bunch off but these seem to be the big points

Thats about the way I look at it. you should hear the liberal bitches on turbobricks piss and moan about everything, I guess on the other hand it will be nice to throw it back in their faces if Obother gets elected.

Sounds to me like you enjoy a little political discussion on other forums as well. Is whats good for the goose not good for the gander or do I need to be more Rush Limbaugh in my speech is I plan to talk politics here?

[Swine]

Or maybe you think I should run my post topics by you for approval before I post them.

From now on do this.

People can educate themselves by going to a political forum, yes?

I think "General Discussion" on a car forum refers to general discussion about cars(even thought many members, including yourself, dont either care or understand this).

Your posts would best be categorized under the "Go Fuck Yourself" section with the description of "Things i dont really want to see". Political shit is shit that i and many dont want to fucking see on god damn fucking car forum. (lol)

Or if you want politics, lets put aspeed members to a vote on if they want 100% political based threads in general discussion. :locked:

[linuxman51]

Sounds to me like you enjoy a little political discussion on other forums as well. Is whats good for the goose not good for the gander or do I need to be more Rush Limbaugh in my speech is I plan to talk politics here?

I refrain from talking about politics on this forum, and turbobricks; both car forums. I will toss political ideas around the table in person with anyone that's reasonably intelligent, in fact its usually fun to get a couple people together and go out and grab a few beers and debate this stuff. Rationality goes out the window on the internet, however, and almost any political discussion ends up being a self-serving circle jerk for whichever "party" happens to have the most members.

Ergo, I dislike the medium in which this message is broadcast.

[Godspeed1976]

From now on do this.
People can educate themselves by going to a political forum, yes?I think "General Discussion" on a car forum refers to general discussion about cars(even thought many members, including yourself, dont either care or understand this).

People can educate themselves
Ahhhh thats kinda like all the porn which people can go to porn sites to get right? Or the ENTIRE NWS that is nothing but a giant copy/pasta catch all, or the 196 Posts about football (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/search.php?searchid=90803) that they should be on sports forums talking about? or the free pizzas (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/search.php?searchid=90806) that they should be on a con man forum talking about? Home Loan Advice (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/showthread.php?t=10734), computers (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/search.php?searchid=90805)and the countless other non car related shit you choose not to point out?

Perhaps that is because some of these non car related threads were started by the admins, and other mods, or something you personally care about. So either you choose to call out people you know cannot discipline you and are attempting to achieve "super cool" interwebs status by talking shit and getting your friends to join in the flame war or you just don't understand the very rules you are trying so hard to pretend you know.

Do not act as though the rest of the forum, who post in general section about non car related topics, do not care. Perhaps they need to go to Swineforums.com and read the rules so they know what is good and acceptable to you. While they are there they can pick up some witty sarcastic lines and impress their friends.

Your posts would best be categorized under the "Go Fuck Yourself" section with the description of "Things i dont really want to see". Political shit is shit that i and many dont want to fucking see on god damn fucking car forum. (lol)

It is funny you bring that up cause under the forum rules it says Before you post: Before posting, please ask yourself the following question: "Am I making a post which is either funny, informative, or interesting on any level?" If you can answer "yes" to this, then please post. If you cannot, then refrain from posting."
Even if you do not like my post it is:

Informative

Interesting on a level of people who are interested in politics. (You know that list of 116 replies to threads that have Obama in the title I posted earlier, that would be those people)


and in addition...

Before you reply: Before replying, please ask yourself the following question: "Does my reply offer any significant advice or help contribute to the conversation in any fashion?" If you can answer "yes" to this, then please reply. If you cannot, then refrain from replying.

In case you cannot wrap your swollen head around it, this means your reply to my thread "I miss talking about cars." falls pretty much under the what you have to say is fucking completely insignificant, and other wise pointless drivel category. Could be considered post whoring, but who is really counting right?.

Or if you want politics, lets put aspeed members to a vote on if they want 100% political based threads in general discussion. :locked:

Put it to a vote, or just keep up what your doing, making rules up as you go along. Whatever you do be consistent in enforcing it, and change the rules to CLEARLY reflect whatever you you decide. That way someone who gives a flying fuck about the world, and this country can talk about it with people who are intelligent enough to carry on a debate whether pro or con. That obviously excludes present company as your to busy getting your panties in a wad about the content I post. Why don't you try this: "If you do not like a thread, then just vote it a "1" and move on (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/showthread.php?t=3615)" as Adam suggested

Get your vote on and GTFO of my thread.

I refrain from talking about politics on this forum, and turbobricks; both car forums. I will toss political ideas around the table in person with anyone that's reasonably intelligent, in fact its usually fun to get a couple people together and go out and grab a few beers and debate this stuff. Rationality goes out the window on the internet, however, and almost any political discussion ends up being a self-serving circle jerk for whichever "party" happens to have the most members.

Ergo, I dislike the medium in which this message is broadcast.

I have faith that aSpeed can provide the "reasonably intelligent" discussions you enjoy in person. The HR 45 thread is an excellent source of information on both sides of the issues. As long as both sides remain mature, and I certainly do not mind debating against a majority.

[adam p]

From now on do this.



I LOLed.

But seriously, BRB to document every time Swine said anything on the board that could possibly contradict what he has just said...with links.

PS - Brock, is that you?

[Anderson]

No Brock is more concise and doesn't goade people into arguments like this, wait what was that word Michael. Douche Canoe. Ah yes. Like this douche canoe. Plus we have all read and gone through this discussion before with Brock, he wouldn't bring it up again. Especially when there isn't much we can do about it since the Messiah was elected to office. This dude is just giving Ron Paulers a bad name. And he should realize and maybe search because we have all been through this before many many times and thats why people are tired of reading it again and again. RPFP

[Swine]

People can educate themselves
Ahhhh thats kinda like all the porn which people can go to porn sites to get right? Or the ENTIRE NWS that is nothing but a giant copy/pasta catch all, or the 196 Posts about football (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/search.php?searchid=90803) that they should be on sports forums talking about? or the free pizzas (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/search.php?searchid=90806) that they should be on a con man forum talking about? Home Loan Advice (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/showthread.php?t=10734), computers (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/search.php?searchid=90805)and the countless other non car related shit you choose not to point out?

Perhaps that is because some of these non car related threads were started by the admins, and other mods, or something you personally care about. So either you choose to call out people you know cannot discipline you and are attempting to achieve "super cool" interwebs status by talking shit and getting your friends to join in the flame war or you just don't understand the very rules you are trying so hard to pretend you know.

Do not act as though the rest of the forum, who post in general section about non car related topics, do not care. Perhaps they need to go to Swineforums.com and read the rules so they know what is good and acceptable to you. While they are there they can pick up some witty sarcastic lines and impress their friends.



It is funny you bring that up cause under the forum rules it says
Even if you do not like my post it is:

Informative

Interesting on a level of people who are interested in politics. (You know that list of 116 replies to threads that have Obama in the title I posted earlier, that would be those people)


and in addition...



In case you cannot wrap your swollen head around it, this means your reply to my thread "I miss talking about cars." falls pretty much under the what you have to say is fucking completely insignificant, and other wise pointless drivel category. Could be considered post whoring, but who is really counting right?.



Put it to a vote, or just keep up what your doing, making rules up as you go along. Whatever you do be consistent in enforcing it, and change the rules to CLEARLY reflect whatever you you decide. That way someone who gives a flying fuck about the world, and this country can talk about it with people who are intelligent enough to carry on a debate whether pro or con. That obviously excludes present company as your to busy getting your panties in a wad about the content I post. Why don't you try this: "If you do not like a thread, then just vote it a "1" and move on (http://forums.aspeedracing.com/showthread.php?t=3615)" as Adam suggested

Get your vote on and GTFO of my thread.



I have faith that aSpeed can provide the "reasonably intelligent" discussions you enjoy in person. The HR 45 thread is an excellent source of information on both sides of the issues. As long as both sides remain mature, and I certainly do not mind debating against a majority.


Your quoteing skills are impeccable! Wow...i, am, IMPRESSED! Im not even mad, seriously...

I am also pleased to learn new things about myself! I never knew that...
-Apparently i am afraid of Adams and Jess's moderating skillz, ORRRRR... I am trying to acheive "super cool" internet status! I am! hw du u do that! I WaNt it so bad OmG!!!1!1!@
-My head is swollen(your mother carries a nasty strand of herpes)
-I have my own internet forum
-Apparently i have witty and sarcastic lines on this internet forum...sounds like badass forum.
-I couldddd be a post whore
-My panties, they are waded.


Btw- you did NOT run this post by me for approval...please remove it immediately.


Kenny put it best. Its just like discussing religion or abortion on the internet, its a dead end conversation that saturates the forum with material that the majority of the general community doesnt want to waste 5 sec's clicking on it. Just like a "repost". Sigh.

...and porn? That shit is hard to come by. Its not like you can type in porn in google and click anyone of the first 1000 links without getting a virus, trust me i know. Typeing politics in google may be more helpful.

For the record, i agree that alot of the topics posted in general should be placed else where...i chose your thread to make a comment. I know you are devastated, but you may have to get over it.

[ANTIVNM]

+1 on Post Whore...

I LOL'd at this entire thread.

Paul Troll is Fail.

:D

[Swine]

I betcha hes formulating a post with so many quotes, examples, links, and awesomeness that it will be listed on, "Forbes: Top 10 Internet Posts", as we speak!:O

Jk Goodsbie...just fucking with you, haveing fun, laughing.

[Godspeed1976]

I betcha hes formulating a post with so many quotes, examples, links, and awesomeness that it will be listed on, "Forbes: Top 10 Internet Posts", as we speak!:O

I betcha hes formulating a post with so many quotes, examples, links, and awesomeness that it will be listed on, "Forbes: Top 10 Internet Posts",

I betcha hes formulating a post with so many quotes, examples, links, and awesomeness that it will be listed

I betcha hes formulating a post with so many quotes, examples, links, and awesomeness

I betcha hes formulating a post

hes formulating a post

hes formulating

formulating

formula

Ahhh haaa! I narrowed your posting critique on my particular post all the way down to the fact that you obviously envy my LT1 Formula...Geeez man if you wanted a ride all you had to do it ask.

Now then if your done playing Conductor Thread Derailroxz I have political forums to troll...and post whore innerwebz bullies to call out. :D

Paul Troll is Fail.
If I got swine to say:
Your posts would best be categorized under the "Go Fuck Yourself" section with the description of "Things i dont really want to see". Then wouldn't Paul Troll be successful? Not to mention the fact that the thread is about Isolationism vs. Non-interventionism vs Interventionism make the successfulness both ironic and somewhat EPIC in a non political way? The whole irony of using Interventionism to push Non-interventionism?

[Sole Maverick]

LOL at this whole thread

[Veedubtrek]

http://blogs.citizen-times.com/blogs/media/blogs/tourists/pancake_bunny.jpg

[ANTIVNM]

pancake_bunny.jpg

Agreed.

[funinthecav3]

LOL i can rest with happy thoughts now :)

[ActiveAero]

Hi

[Godspeed1976]

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l60/hate427/flamingdeath.gif

[linuxman51]

Your quoteing skills are impeccable! Wow...i, am, IMPRESSED! Im not even mad, seriously...

I am also pleased to learn new things about myself! I never knew that...
-Apparently i am afraid of Adams and Jess's moderating skillz, ORRRRR... I am trying to acheive "super cool" internet status! I am! hw du u do that! I WaNt it so bad OmG!!!1!1!@
-My head is swollen(your mother carries a nasty strand of herpes)
-I have my own internet forum
-Apparently i have witty and sarcastic lines on this internet forum...sounds like badass forum.
-I couldddd be a post whore
-My panties, they are waded.



baaaaahahahahahahahahahhahaah :rock:

[linuxman51]

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l60/hate427/flamingdeath.gif

just don't piss on him, that would smell bad.

[Godspeed1976]

Ron Paul Drives a Lincoln Town Car and Buick Skylark. Perhaps I misjudged his instincts.
http://www.desktopcar.net/wallpaper/8450-2/Lincoln_Town-Car_96.jpg
http://www.avto-otchet.net/CarReviews/2267_0.jpg

now...we have another car thread in general, and I have pulled this thread around to Swine standards of posting.:steering: